M&D: Just from DJing a lot too, I do get that feeling you were talking about, learning what people want. People are leaning towards this more euphoric atmosphere, a shedding of cynicism that's been building up.

JD: I also wonder though — I know this is a weird thing to say — I think our age is a really interesting thing. We're young and we're old at the same time, and I think our music tastes are cyclically coming back to something we were into when we were teenagers. Also, we understand this other element of queer past, queer history.

M&D: Yeah, I'm really getting into Black Box these days! (laughter) Maybe that whole young/old, getting older-but-not-old-yet thing ties in to the theme for our first issue, “Firsts.” Just talking to people and reading other interviews, I feel that especially now, artists and musicians are really inhibited about saying that they're artists and musicians. “Is this really what I'm doing? Does this sound like a waste of time to everyone else?” So I wanted to ask when you guys first decided, “I actually am an artist, and this is what I'm doing.”

JD: Was it at the bank the other day?

(laughter)

MO: Actually it was! We were opening up our band bank account, and the guy asked me what my occupation was, and it was the first time that I said, “musician.” Up until now, (the job I've had is going out of business, conveniently) we were getting really busy, but I've alway's had another job and have always said “Yeah, I play music, but I don't know, it's not necessarily my job.” Not that it always has to be equated with how you make money, but I guess by American standards perhaps it does.

JD: Hmm...I don't know what my answer is to that question. I've been saying I'm a musician or an artist for a long time, but I'm part of that group of people that feels really weird about it....I don't think I even really deserve to say that.

GBT: It's funny, someone asked me the other day that knows the kind of work that I've been doing, and I told them about a project that my friends and I just did, building a roof in a small town in Pennsylvania. This person asked, “But are you doing any artwork?” It was while we were on tour, and I thought, everything that I'm doing is all part of the same thing, it's not about distinguishing this part and this thing...

MO: Or that building a roof is not an art project.

GBT: Exactly.

JD: It totally is...especially when I saw it.

(laughter)

GBT: 'Cause its not done!

JD: It's beautiful though.

GBT: It's a work in progress.